Lol. This country just voted to move in the opposite direction of this. We voted for less worker rights. Less power for the average person.
At this point, we’ll need to start utilizing our 2nd amendment right if we want to get anything better than what we have. People died to give us the 40 hour work week. Looks like that’s going to have to happen again for any further improvements.
Smarter countries did it without the bloodshed. America isn’t that smart.
My dipshit coworkers think trump will actually be good for unions. Mfers.
I’d like to add that 32 hour weeks is pretty much purely something that works for white collar work. It’s considerably harder to implement in blue collar settings.
Not true. The electricians in my area work 7 hour days and the sheet metal workers get every other Friday off.I know machinists who work 3 12s.
It’s not, really. It would be easy to implement at any company that makes a decent profit margin. Productivity goes up with shorter working hours, anyway.
Productivity goes up with shorter working hours, anyway.
That is pretty much entirely untrue with blue collar jobs. I’m working from the start to the end of my shift—working less or more hours as I do depending on the season doesn’t change that. Pace stays about the same.
It would be easy to implement at any company that makes a decent profit margin.
Slower production isn’t just about profit margins–it’s also about fulfilling your customers needs
My dipshit coworkers think trump will actually be good for unions. Mfers.
Are y’all in a union? If so, you should see if you and your friends could maybe schedule an appointment with an organizer at your Local, who might be able to walk these chuds through it.
We are already unionized, which tbh makes it worse.
It’s part of my position as union stewards duty to walk these chuds through it
Bummer…
The mental gymnastics required to believe that hurt my brain.
Is the reason it wont work in blue collar settings that it’ll inflate prices of stuff too high? Possible making the country fall back in a global stance on pricing on exports, etc (not competitive)?
Only other reason I can see is if they need people at the workplace 24/7, but they usually hire more people to make that schedule work (which in return ig increases prices of whatever they are producing).
Not “won’t work”. Considerably harder. Big difference. There’s companies who have successfully implemented it in blue collar jobs.
But more put simple, it’s that unlike white collar, output has a direct relationship with how many hours are worked, up to probably nearly 50, more or less depending on the job.
So, in practice it turned out that slower service was one of the largest problems with it.
Half of the benefit issue costs would go away with universal healthcare anyways.
Sure you can get more employees, but people who work don’t magically appear
'preciate the edumacation. Definitely sounds like a harder problem to solve, good point on the universal healthcare, I’m sure that could save some money for companies, it’ll make employees happie regardless to not have to worry about paying doctor bills.
Want happier employees?
No. American corporations absolutely do not care about how happy their employees are. They only care about maximizing profits, and the best way to do that is to squeeze as much productivity out of their workers while also paying those workers as little as possible.
They know the workers aren’t there to find fucking happiness. Few are so privileged. Most people go to work not because it makes them happy, but because they need the god damn money, to keep a roof over their head and to put food on the dinner table, and as everything gets more expensive, the workers need more and more money, to stave off homelessness and destitution. Happiness, Jesus Christ. What a luxury!
The purpose of capitalism isn’t to make people happy. It’s to make profit for owners. That’s it.
It’s not even about max productivity, as it’s well established over long run you get better productivity in many jobs working 4 days and better vacation etc, the suffering is literally the point for many of these fucks. Whether they admit this outright or not
It’s hard to explain, but I have a hard time believing it’s just sadism. Maybe it has to do with the productivity gains from a four day work week taking time to realize. Like you said, over the long run you get better productivity, but maybe the corporations are just more interested in short term profits.
Want happier employees?
No, not really.
- The owner classthat’s a bit unrealistic. The expected answer is “will this make line go up?”
No. Happier employees almost always do make the line go up in the long term, but most employers don’t understand that, can’t look further ahead than the next quarter, and think of an employee is happy it’s a sign they must be slacking off.
They do understand that. The problem IS “long term.” Most C level types don’t care about any term longer than their tenure. This is why we see layoffs before quarterly reports. There isn’t an incentive for them to look any furthure into the future.
Now if a CEO could only cash out after 10 or 20 years of the company doing well then we would see change. If they made the company average untill they were a decade or two in as a vesting term then keeping happy employees would be important.
Nah. It’s “will this make line go up by next quarter?”
Short term profits are the only profits that matter to high frequency stock traders.
Lmao they don’t want happier employees they want more money
I deeply wish this would happen, but know it would never happen in my lifetime in my country.
I’ve been working full time, sometimes overtime, for almost five years out of college. I want to practice piano more. I’d love to volunteer. I want to go outside more. I’ve always wanted to spend a month backpacking in the Pacific Northwest. It’s been my lifelong dream to write a book.
I’m so exhausted after work every single day that I can only get myself to play piano for a half an hour, and then play video games or read until I pass out before my bedtime.
four weeks? hell no, i’d walk from any interview that attempted to strip two weeks of vacation from me.
Exactly. The “wild fantasies” of Americans seem to be “below average” European.
Cuz we get so much less
4 weeks is still not on par with other civilised countries. Living here in the UK now, 5 weeks is standard. When I was in the Netherlands I was getting six.
Know what really hurts?
Running into foreigners in your own city who tell you about how they’re on a multi-week vacation to America and they’ll probably do it again to another country again next year. I’ve had that happen multiple times while out at bars in my city.
Meanwhile, I’ve barely crossed state lines in my entire adulthood because it’s hard to even get a 3-4 day extended weekend.
America sucks y’all.
Join a union. I work part time in America. After just one year of working I had 3 weeks of vacation. After 3 I now have 4 weeks and am taking my 2nd international trip of the year and 3rd vacation trip of the year.
Or better yet, unionize your own workplace with vacations as the primary demand
Wait,you guys don’t get that? Shit I’m.here in Northern Ireland and that would be less than standard. That’s what we give teenagers,hell,most teens would not take that deal. When did America start treating the worker so bad? Like 1865?
America was built on treating the worker badly. Most of the first people that came here were either slaves or indentured servants. Chinese people got exploited to build the railroads, and then banned from being citizens in the country. Now we have prison slavery and wage servitude. There are a million and one examples, but exploiting the worker is as American as apple pie.
The only thing that has ever really improved in American labor is actual safety standards for work environments, equipment, etc. We do a great job of prioritizing that. But actual workers are viewed as expendable, and many of the largest employers are just meat grinders even if they offer half-decent benefits. Walmart is a good example of that
It’s such a bummer when I hear about the burial lack of workers rights over there. How is there not mass migration to Europe?
Many of the people who would have been criminalized for minor things like smoking cannabis to cope with the horrific work culture and thus are ineligible for work visas to most of the world. Many of those with the resources to do so have bought into the system and don’t know what the rest of the world is like, and there’s another group who just think the US is swell and everyone else is jealous of us and trying to come here.
Because, for many people, it’s not all that easy to get the requisite visas to go to Europe legally. As it stands now, I’m pretty sure I’m the only person in my household of 3 who has a few options to get skilled work visas based on my work experience. In another few years, when we’ve all finished our degrees, we’re looking at making the leap.
For other people, they might already have put down roots that hold them back before considering what a raw deal they’re getting. Even if someone can qualify to emigrate, significant others, kids or property can make it more difficult for them to decide to go for it.
And, of course, you have plenty of folks who drink too deeply of the Kool-Aid, and believe Fox News when they say Europe is overrun by communist governments that implement Sharia law in their gulags, and force you to be gay to hit the national quotas.
“But worker rights that is socialism! Socialism is evil because the soviets say they are that!”
Yea everyone knows how that great socialist state of ireland
we never stopped. One week vacation per year is considered a perk at most jobs that offer it.
One week? Do you get like 46 days of bank holiday?
I don’t know how many banking holidays there are but they typically are only observed by people working at banks… Personally speaking, I’ve never had a job that gave any holidays off, but I also never had a job that gave vacation time, even though some of them said they did on paper.
No, it’s usually somewhere between 5 and 12 and none of them are mandatory.
Edit: if I’m translating that right, anyway.
Legally, I get 1 hour of sick leave for every 40 hours worked. And this is a pro-worker state, most states don’t mandate any sick leave at all.
1 hour of sick a week ? That doesn’t make sense, you can’t plan being sick. How does that work? What if your sick fir one hour and ten minutes
The way paid time off works in WA is that it goes into a fund that you get paid out of for missing work. So, a minimum of one hour of wages gets added to the pot for every full week of work.
I go to therapy weekly, so I can choose to either take my PTO to cover the hour I miss each week, or I can choose to save it for when I actually get sick. Hypothetically, I could also save it for a vacation, but I’m not bougie enough to take a vacation.
Everyone deserves a holiday
You have 32h/week as a standard?
Yeah its slowly becoming the standard
That’s awesome! I was actually looking into moving to Ireland (not the TERF-island part tho). Sadly their trans healthcare is also sub par.
Your sexuality is not a personality
Cool. Didn’t talk about my sexuality. Weird that you would bring that up, are you well?
Well full time is 36plus i think
32h work week?
Your premise is flawed in the first sentence - “Want happier employees?” No American employer cares about that in the least. Being happy at being allowed to keep their job and keep showing up to collect your meager pay is about all you can expect.
came in to comment effectively this., but you phrased it better than I would have.
“But happy employees naturally work harder” yeah, but so do desperate employees, and that also satisfies corpo desire for abusable slaves.
Don’t forget the healthy dose of salary and humane treatment.
I would literally take a life for that work balance.
40-50hrs a week isn’t a life worth living
Ikr. I can’t even find time to go to gym cuz of commute. That alone just drains whatever energy I had left from the day and so I just scrap by with the few things I can do later in the evening. Sucks man.
The next ad you see: “The only device that lets you work-out, on your way-out, to work!”
A sad world indeed.
Only 4 weeks? In much of Europe, 5-6 weeks is the norm.
It’s 7 days in Singapore 🫠
But most white collar jobs here are around 18-21 days.
32hr workweek as a transition period down to 24 or even 20. 4 weeks PTO for new hires or something, add 2 weeks per year up to like 8 or 10, or even 12?
Fuck capitalism.
That’s how I sounded like before I got married and became a father. Now I want to be CFO instead. Funny how that goes.
Bless capitalism
If you’re implying you want to spend as much time away from your family as possible, you could just get a divorce. Wouldn’t have to sell all your life to shareholders then.
I got 5 evenings and 2 days on the weekend, it’s plenty
congratulations. go back to work.
i’m sure dedicating your entire life to working for others will make you happy.
Yeah, I like working for my family since I love them
it shouldn’t be necessary to work us so hard for them to get their value out of us though.
we could be helping our families without throwing our lives away.
That’s fine. Work as much as you want. Just expect your income to accompany your productivity.
My wife works 14 hours a week, if she wants more money then she doesn’t just take it from my account, she just goes and work more.
I put my money in stocks
The money goes to our kid. Not to her luxuries.
So… You want to avoid your family?
Nah, I want my kid to be a millionaire. Takes me 37,5 work hours a week
Your kid is going to be a little shit with a father like you and all that money handed to them.
🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
Money won’t be handed to the kid. Just the naked property rights until I die.
To prevent paying far too many taxes of course.
150k euros every 3 years at 3% taxes. Obviously undervalued property.
Kid will grow up like I did. Low consumption spending, high savings rate.
Kid will grow up like I did.
Like I said.
Man having a wife and kid made me want to be at home more, not less. I would leap at the opportunity to have 32 hour weeks and tons of vacation. I would even consider going into the office a second day of the week for that.
I worked 0 hours before having a reason to work. I barely need money. I make money for my family.
Now imagine being able to provide for your family without being away from your family for so long.
Kids tend to go to school after age of 3
School is 40+ hours a week?
With home work added to it? Working is easier. School ends at 15 40, kid will be home around 16 10 and I’m home around 16 45
You think the kid can survive 35 min without me?
You know, you could just talk with your wife and/or find something more worthwhile to do than putting in the maximum physically possible hours at work.
Or just get a divorce, because that’s faster and cheaper than avoiding your family until your wife divorces you and your kids resent you, and has the same end result.
My dad worked more than me, nobody resented him. My inheritance was 500k euros. My kid’s inheritance will be above a million euros.
Silly people
“Silly people” says the guy who hit the birth lottery of inheriting fuck you money from the start and still can’t think of anything worthwhile to do.
Why do you even work with 500k in the bank? Why don’t you live off your investments and capital gains somewhere in the carribean? Why do you think your kids need even more money instead of their Dad being there? Holy shit.
Because the kid is better off in Belgium than in Indonesia.
My parents started with 0. Why would I be as selfish as to waste their money? It’s not my money. It’s my family’s money.
It just lowers our cost of living and gains compound interest.
My kid will have the naked property of it until I die. It’s never being sold.
Lottery lol, it’s just a guy working 40 years. The stuff none of you want to do here.
My parents lived at their parents till 30.
“The stuff none of you want to do here” 🫠
You couldn’t possibly sound more like an out of touch boomer if you tried. But I guess we’re done here, I think i have a pretty good grasp of your mindset already
Me and my brother copying my dad’s mindset basically, so yeah.
All of us earn pretty good money on the labour market
I always wonder why people like this are on here.
Do you require an echo chamber or do you want to actually bring change?
If you can’t even convince me.
I worked a year 32h a week. I don’t see the issue why you don’t just do that. You get paid for those 32 hours ya know
I have no clue what you’re trying to say.
You don’t understand much
Aren’t trying to explain yourself either, you’re either a troll or don’t understand it yourself.
Nah it’s comprehensible.
You don’t understand why I’m here.
I gave you explanation, then you didn’t understand it.
Hence it’s rather funny that you don’t seem to understand anything.
Another attempt.
This is Lemmy, just like Reddit it is structured into echo chambers. The current politics is dominated by polarisation. A lot of right Vs left. Little amount of people being centrists.
You being leftist, don’t understand that someone on the right side would be here.
So you just continue the polarisation (which greatly harms you btw, right wing is winning tremendously because of this).
So, tbh I prefer to be a centrist.
So for the love of god. Can any of you fucks actually convince me of your desire of a 32h work week.
Give good arguments. Logical ones. So that the people without empathy might give a damn. Learn to convince people.
Ok, Boomer.
I’m 29, just not 19 like you folks
This checks out. You sound EXACTLY like me when I was 29 and an insufferable know-nothing piece of shit. Now I’m embarrassed for both of us.
Ah doesn’t matter, I’m in my prime.
Having boomer opinions is a mindset thing, not an age thing.
Also: I’m older than you.
Are you richer than me tho
did you win the birth lottery and get handed a pile of money like me tho
FTFY
It’s because my parents had jobs and didn’t waste the money 😬
Non sequitur much?
I’m 38. I used to think like you. Then I realised it was a business not a person and my boss wasn’t my friend, and that I should be getting more for less.
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This is all great, for you, if you want to live your life like this, but I don’t understand why you think that this should be standard.
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wife bad amirite
She will work 20 hours a week and now during pregnancy she doesn’t work at all.
Being a responsible father is good.
You know, most countries have both time off for expecting women and paid time off for mothers of newborns and increasingly for the fathers too.
I live in one of those countries. 20 days for me. 1 august to february for my wife.
I’m gonna ask her company to give her the rest off as well during pregnancy unpaid.
your dangerfield needs work
Sitting at home on my toilet married with a child. So I feel equally qualified to say this as you.
Fuck capitalism and that exploitation. What, you used to have empathy and care and now you’re a selfish asshole? How is that good, it’s definitely not funny, it’s just sad.
Who said I ever had empathy? I use logic. If you’re going to try and convince me, I’d suggest trying to use logic as well. It’s fairly easy to convince people with logic. Using your emotions etc will only cause polarisation, echo chambers, …
If you want to work 32 hours, go work 32 hours. Nobody is stopping you.
I’ve worked 32 hours for a year. Has its benefits. Just less money. Now that my wife is working half time, I’m obviously going to work more.
You know what work reform I’d love to see? One where pay is based on production. Not time. So when I do twice what you do in the same amount of time, I bring home twice the money.
Cool, you’re shitting on people getting more vacation time and better pay for … What reason again? Because you got married and had a kid?
Use logic to make that make sense to me. Also I’ll hit you with some logic right here, your own in fact.
You know what work reform I’d love to see? One where pay is based on production.
Sweet, worker productivity has soared while wages stagnated. Paying people the same amount of money to do 32 hours of work vs 40 is a step towards making pay more aligned with production. Exactly what you want!
I want the wage system abolished. Everyone should be a sub-contractor. Paid on what they provide. Not on how much time they are there.
My co-workers are people like here. They say “don’t have ambition” “we’re just work folk” “if you do double the work you only get paid the same amount anyways”.
The mentality my family doesn’t have. Somehow my family all end up being high earners.
Yeah we get it you’re awesome and whatever. Maybe if your coworkers were compensated for their efforts instead of taken advantage of they’d feel different about putting more work in.
Hell that last complaint you listed from your coworkers is literally the same thing you’re complaining about.
You’re still part of the proletariat, stop shilling for the bourgeoisie.
I’m petite bourgeoisie, half my income comes from capital.
My workplace is very leftist. It’s a hospital, the income is all thanks to subsidies from the tax payers.
Everyone is paid based on a barema, everyone gets the same. That’s because of unions. I’m fine with that. But I’m learning everything about the hospital and will demand a higher position or simply go to another hospital that agrees to give me that.
I despise stagnation. These coworkers do the same job as I do, I’m 29 and they are in their 50s.
The 24 year old newbie is more productive than those oldies. Our generation has been educated more profoundly.
These oldies can only do their own tasks and if you ask them anything else, they freak out.
The younger generation is a lot more flexible. I’m learning the tasks of everyone at the department. Then I’ll expand it to finance. I have my eyes on multiple positions and the people who have those positions are actual capable workers.
The thing I’m earning on top of my wage is experience (human capital).
if you always do the same tasks year after year, you’re basically… well… you’re replaceable by AI.
Who said I ever had empathy? I use logic.
Honestly all that needed to be said. Fucking utilitarians.
Empaths are pretty boring. Basically like toddlers throwing tantrums
Logically, your family’s world would be a better place without you in it. Your resources could all go to your child and you could stop wasting them, and your wife can find someone who actually loves her and her child.
Why don’t you do what’s logically best for your child?
Nah because the child isn’t born yet, the money would go to my brother.
If I didn’t love my wife, I would just discard her and be a deadbeat father.
I’m not really wasting resources, my net worth increases every day because I’m the main source of income for my family. If I would die, my wife would have to look for another man.
Men aren’t really interested in raising another guy’s child.
I would kill you without a second’s hesitation if you threaten my child’s well being
You know what work reform I’d love to see? One where pay is based on production. Not time.
Funny, that’s what we want too. Production now is higher than ever before in the history of humanity, yet our wages and salaries have been stagnant for decades. If we are producing more than ever before, why do we need to work so many hours per week? We should either be fairly compensated for that productivity or we should not be required to produce more than we are fairly paid for, which should translate to either a drastic salary increase to match the increased demand for productivity or a drastic decrease in hours worked (without a reduction in pay, since you agree that pay should be based on production).
If you lower your working hours to 32 hours per week then this would happen.
Foreign countries their labour will gain in desirability for capital.
Your area will still require the environment to keep you alive, so if you are simply surviving, then it would be a good choice for you.
Now, I live in Belgium. We have a median net worth of 250k euros per adult. We have a lot to lose. If we work less, we simply have less money.
The good thing to do, would be to earn more money. Not work less.
You know how much Indonesians work? Singaporeans? Chinese? They work more than us.
Belgians statistically work only a few hours a week. Do you think our high median net wealth came from nothing?
We work at our property after our hours.
My dad never hired anyone to do anything in the house. He did everything himself. We don’t have a gardener. We do all of it ourselves.
Belgians work part time for themselves.
The truth is that value does not come without labour. Can’t magically lay on the couch and expect value to arise.
I mean, don’t get me wrong, I’d take more money too. However, I think I’d be happier with more time off to do the things I enjoy and also the things I don’t really enjoy but have to get done anyway, like chores and housework, since those are also part of my day that gets eaten up by my job.
I wouldn’t expect a nepo baby like you to understand that though. You got everything in life handed to you, so it’s no big surprise you lack empathy for your fellow man.
I don’t have empathy because of a personality disorder or autism. Could be either, I don’t know.
Most people are incapable of living with their parents in the west, so they waste their income on rent and utilities.
We live with 4 adults in one home, so our costs are extremely low and our income is high.
If your parents couldn’t own a house in the 20th century, then that sucks for them. The west was booming.
My parents didn’t go on vacations, they didnt buy luxuries, they just built a house and bought land. The economy around us grew a lot because it’s west Europe. (Capitalism is why)
Nice LARP, kid
My dick’s the size of a banana, adult
Start paying people enough that they can actually live instead of struggling just to keep their heads above water.
Okay i agree now what
